1

Topic: Skills?

Probably I've played a little too much Fallout 3 lately, but it got me thinking about the SMACK system again. smile

Now, I'm not planning anything specific at the moment, but I started pondering the merits of skills as opposed to just stats. Technically, it wouldn't be all that hard to implement, but might add a lot of flavor. I'm thinking each skill would "belong" to a SMACK statistic. The governing statistic would control the effectiveness of that skill. SMACK would be based on a 1-10 scale. Skills would be on a 1-100 scale. Both could be pushed past those maximums, but it would be more expensive.

For an example, let's say you have an "Energy Weapons" skill of 50, which is governed by your Mind statistic (of 7). Your total talent would be determined as:

Talent = (Mind * 10%) * Skill

or in this example:

Talent = 70% * 50 = 35

A "normal" skill roll would be this calculated number, plus a 1-100, versus 100. Circumstances, perks, items, etc. could all modify this in several ways. You might have attached a scope to your laser rifle (for +10 to your roll), and the rifle itself might be well-calibrated (+5). The target might be very close, lowering the target number to 75 instead of 100. Or maybe you selected a perk that lets you specialize in laser rifles (+20 Energy Weapons with laser rifles), and so on. Tasks would have a difficulty, which would determine the target roll:

Cakewalk (50): Shooting a target standing motionless in front of you with your shotgun, creating a sharpened spear from a wooden pole, fleeing from a carnivorous plant that's still 20 meters away.
Easy (75): Shooting a 5 meter distant target with your pistol, haggling with a merchant that likes you, picking an old lock.
Normal (100): Shooting a 30 meter distant target with your rifle, haggling with a merchant that is neutral toward you, making gold contacts.
Challenging (125): Shooting a 50 meter distant target with your rifle, picking a deadbolt lock, disarming a crude explosive trap.
Difficult (150): Shooting a 100 meter distant target with your rifle, haggling with a merchant that detests you, tricking a thief into telling you where he hid the loot.
Impossible (200): Shooting a 100 meter distant target with a zip-gun, haggling with a bounty hunter that is looking to collect on your head, fleeing from a swarm of 20 giant ants, dodging a shotgun blast at point-blank range.

So it would come down to a combination of skill and stat against difficulty. Stats would affect each skill under them. At each level you'd get skill points to spend, instead of getting stat increases (you could still increase stats with perks and special items or events). Stats would start at 5 points each, and you'd start with 5 more points to add in as you saw fit. Karma would probably not have any specific skills under it, but would impact everything else (like giving you a Karma% chance that any given skill would be doubled for that check).

Sometimes skills would be opposed...your Small Arms skill might be opposed by your opponent's Concealment skill, or Hand-to-Hand Combat by Dodge. Some example skills:

Strength
Hand-to-Hand Combat
Intimidate
Throw
Primitive Weapons
Stamina

Mind
Energy Weapons
Electronics
Goldsmithing
Concealment
First Aid
Willpower

Agility
Small Arms
Dodge
Pick Lock
Flee
Explosives

Charisma
Haggle
Persuade
Entertain

Anyway, nothing's decided, but feel free to discuss. smile

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2

Re: Skills?

Interesting idea.  Something like the Morrowind/Oblivion skill tree, where each skill is based on an ability score.

Something to think about here  is that maybe each character should have a "base" value in each skill. Not a very high one of course, but maybe a 5 or 10%.  (Maybe this is someplace else Karma could come in?  Karma/2 for the base skill?)  Each time you use the skill properly (successfully hit something with your weapon, or haggle to lower the price on something) you would get a slight chance to increase your skill in that range?  Using Morrowind/Oblivion as a rule, the more you use the skill, the better you get at it?

More later...after I've chewed on it a bit.

I think I've experienced this deja vu before...
http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=Todd%20Lope  http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=sambrookjm http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=Lisa%20Bailey

3

Re: Skills?

I would think everyone would start with some basic skill, depending on the associated starting attribute. They could then "tag" a few (three or four, maybe) that represent what they learned as a child, and those tagged ones would get extra points (15?) right off the bat.

I don't think I'd want skills climbing just from use, or people will do strange things just to "farm" the skills (like hopping across the landscape in Oblivion to raise Athletics). I like the Fallout approach of giving you points at each level based on your Mind attribute.

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4

Re: Skills?

Brother Erryn wrote:

I would think everyone would start with some basic skill, depending on the associated starting attribute. They could then "tag" a few (three or four, maybe) that represent what they learned as a child, and those tagged ones would get extra points (15?) right off the bat.

I don't think I'd want skills climbing just from use, or people will do strange things just to "farm" the skills (like hopping across the landscape in Oblivion to raise Athletics). I like the Fallout approach of giving you points at each level based on your Mind attribute.

Swimming worked better for raising your Athletics, but your point still stands. :-)

Would the tagged skills be chosen like the *original* MFoN had (questions about your childhood) or would you actually be able to choose skills A, B,C and D to be raised.

I haven't played Fallout3 (I was one of the few folks who didn't really like the original Fallout series.  Not sure why...it just didn't click with me.) so I have no idea how that skill raising works.  Would the abilities still go up 5 for (SMA) and 1 for (CK) each level?  Is it like D&D, where each level you get a certain number of skill points to put into your skills, depending on what your class and intelligence (Mind here) are?

I think I've experienced this deja vu before...
http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=Todd%20Lope  http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=sambrookjm http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=Lisa%20Bailey

5

Re: Skills?

I think I'd just let people pick them directly.

The idea would be that SMACK would not raise every level, only by special events or perks. You'd get skill points every level instead, based on your Mind attribute (more Mind = more skill points each level). Strength would determine number of slots, Agility would determine your daily actions (!) , and Charisma would determine your base reputation with factions and your starting cash.

The idea is that skills can be learned, but SMACK represents your innate characteristics...not something easily changed.

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6

Re: Skills?

Howsabout we bring back the quiz at the beggining to decide initial stats?

PREPARE TO BE...TURDINATED
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7

Re: Skills?

I'm not opposed to reintroducing that, but a lot of people would prefer to just pick what they want and go. I'd need to make it bypassable.

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8

Re: Skills?

Would this be another reboot (MFoN 3.0) or would our characters be set back to level 1 and then pick the perks/mutations to get them back to their current level?

Given a choice, I'd rather just pick the stats myself, but options are always a good thing to have.

I think I've experienced this deja vu before...
http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=Todd%20Lope  http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=sambrookjm http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=Lisa%20Bailey

9

Re: Skills?

I would think you'd just pick your stats/skills like a new character, but get additional up-front skill points based on your level. Unlike going from 1.0 to 2.0, the basic data structures wouldn't change.

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10

Re: Skills?

So anybody have specific pros or cons to doing this?

I keep liking it more and more the more I think about it. I could easily attach skill checks to conversation branches. And I think having specific skills would help me remember to have more in the game than just combat encounters (like locks to pick, special bartering options for NPCs, medical checks for healing self and others, Persuade, Intimidate, Entertain, etc.). I'm having trouble thinking of any real negatives to it.

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11

Re: Skills?

The more I think about it, the more I like it, too.

http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=breckinshire

12

Re: Skills?

I too also like skill checks!

13

Re: Skills?

The idea is good...I'm curious what would happen when other skills are added to the mix after you have already distributed your skill points.

I think I've experienced this deja vu before...
http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=Todd%20Lope  http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=sambrookjm http://www.atomicmonks.com/sig.php?a=av&pname=Lisa%20Bailey

14

Re: Skills?

Ideally the initial list would be generic enough to cover most situations. If another skill were to be added later, I'd probably default it to some value based on the character level and let you just take it from there.

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15

Re: Skills?

As a basic idea, how about high Charisma can charm, high Mind can outsmart/answer tricky questions, and Strength can intimidate etc.

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16

Re: Skills?

If you'll note, I actually put Persuade and Intimidate up there as skills. smile

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17

Re: Skills?

Ah..ooooppsie

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